Minutes of the 9th Meeting of the Freshwater Fisheries Forum Steering Group held at Municipal Buildings, Corn Exchange Road, Stirling on Tuesday 20th September 2005.
In attendance:
Gordon Brown - SEERAD (Chairman)
David Dunkley - SEERAD
Manson Wright - SEERAD
David Ford - SEERAD
Alistair Prior - SEERAD
Mabel McDowall - SEERAD (Secretariat)
Andrew Wallace - Association of Salmon Fishery Boards
Brian Davidson - Association of Salmon Fishery Boards
George Holdsworth - Association of Scottish Stillwater Fisheries
Willie Miller - Consultative Committee on Protection Orders
Ross Gardiner - Fisheries Research Services
Alastair Stephen - Institute of Fisheries Management
Roger Brook - Rivers and Fisheries Trusts of Scotland
Lawson Devery - Salmon and Trout Association
Ronnie Picken - Scottish Anglers National Association
Ron Woods - Scottish Federation for Coarse Angling
David Howell - Scottish Natural Heritage
Miranda Lindsay - Scottish Rural Property and Business Association
Derek Keith - Scottish Campaign for Public Angling
Craig Campbell - NFU Scotland
Peter Maitland - Fish Conservation Centre
Willie Shearer - Salmon Net Fishing Association of Scotland
1. Introduction
The Chairman welcomed Steering Group members and introduced Lawson Devery from the Salmon and Trout Association and Mabel McDowall from SEERAD.
2. Apologies
Seymour Monro - Atlantic Salmon Trust, Callum Sinclair - Scottish Environment Protection Agency, John Armstrong - Fisheries Research Service.
3. Minutes of Previous Meeting
The Steering Group approved the minutes with the following amendments:
Callum Sinclair had sent apologies, but they had not been recorded.
Agreed amendments have been made to the sections on Fragmented Coverage and Rod Licensing
Action - Secretary to amend the minutes and put on the website
4. Matters Arising
Task Matrix
It had been agreed at the last meeting that the section relating to annual/weekly close times for grayling could be taken out, but that this had not happened. The Secretary advised that the Task Matrix has been amended accordingly and that the revised version is now available on the web site.
Highlands andIslands Aquaculture Forum
This would be included under item 5 on the main agenda
Freshwater Fisheries Forum
Transcript and additional comments now on the web site.
Licensing Proposals for Regulating the Removal of Fish
SEERAD still in consultation with Solicitors and will produce a paper shortly. This paper will be circulated to members for discussion.
Action - SEERAD to produce a paper and circulate to group members for discussion.
Access
This would be included under item 5 on the main agenda
Public Lochs - SEERAD had agreed to investigate what constitutes a public loch, but this has proved to be a fairly complex undertaking. David Dunkley agreed to produce a short note clarifying his findings. He did, however, advise that this should be used for reference only as ultimately final determinations were a matter for the courts.
Action - SEERAD to produce note clarifying findings
Alternatives to the System of Protection Order Areas
At the previous meeting, members of the Steering Group were asked to provide SEERAD with any views/thoughts. Organisations have made representations through the wider consultation of the 'Bill'.
Management
Tenders have been sent out and were due to be returned by 19/9/05. Update - tenders returned and evaluation in progress.
5. Presentation and Discussion on the Aquaculture and Fisheries Bill
Gordon Brown introduced this session. He stressed that although a huge amount of work had already been undertaken by officials there was still a tremendous amount of work to be done especially in area of Policy development.
He spoke briefly about the complexities of the task in hand. He thanked the Group, highlighting its role in assisting with the development of ideas and the identification of issues. As yet, no decisions have been made as policy options are continuing to be identified and investigated with Lawyers.
David Ford gave a presentation outlining the proposed timetable for the various stages of the Bill process, and gave an update on progress made to date. He touched on a number of different topics relating to the Freshwater Fisheries, Aquaculture and Sea Fisheries. Hard copies of the slides were circulated to all attendees.
The discussion that followed resulted in a significant number of questions and observations being raised on the following subjects:
Fish Movements
It was suggested that guidance on the responsibilities of all involved would need to be provided in relation to live fish movements and that it would be necessary to specify in detail how fish movements would be defined and regulated. In addition, the financial impact of regulating movements within and between catchment areas would need to be considered by the Regulatory Impact Assessment that must accompany the Bill.
If fish movements were to be licensed, then it was suggested that this would have to apply to all types of fish movements; It was pointed out that although all District Salmon Fishery Boards and put and take fisheries should have records, it would be necessary to identify and stop the movements of inappropriate fish to inappropriate locations. Fish in transit should have paperwork with them. However, there needs to be clarity as to what enforcement measures would be. The group recognised that there would be difficulties in enforcement particularly concerning small scale movements. The group asked whether the Regulator would be able to work with the police to stop vehicles?
Although aquaria were not seen as a concern, it was suggested that there also needs to be clarification regarding the movements of ornamental fish. The question was also raised whether it would it be possible for licences be issued to hatcheries which would specify where each consignment of fish goes.
Finally, it was noted that further funding would be required, but that once more information was published in the consultation document, the Group could more easily identify likely costs;
Containment:
Considerable concern regarding escapes was expressed, and the feeling was that it would be vital for all concerned to strive to make sure that escapes do not happen in the first place. It is the intention that there would be a Regulator who would have access to records of stocking for fish farms. However, it was envisaged that there could be difficulties establishing how many fish have escaped. The Group referred to the forthcoming Aquaculture code of practice and asked whether such a code, or the need to adhere to it, could be enshrined in statute? They also asked whether an Industry Code of Practice be used as an approach to fisheries management? It was confirmed that any new the containment rules would also apply to freshwater fish farms.
Gyrodactylus salaris:
The Gs task force has now convened and should be reporting in March. The group were advised that if there were strong recommendations made in their report, there would still be time for them to be included in the Bill. As there is the potential for spreading Gs by way of the import of eggs or fish, work needs to be undertaken with regard to the development of the fish health directive to ensure that Gs is dealt with adequately. Gordon Brown has asked Dave Wyman from SEERAD Aquaculture Health and Welfare branch to brief the steering group on the fish health directive.
Action - SEERAD to arrange briefing
Technical changes:
It was not clear who would be responsible for the enforcement of new measures. At the moment, bailiffs are generally not empowered to enforce measures other than those related to salmon or salmon fishing. It is the intention that in future the management of all species and fisheries and its associated enforcement would be carried out by the proposed Unitary Authorities. However, the Executive should give consideration as to how the new measures would be enforced in the interim.
Access:
Concerns were raised about blanket exclusions with regard to Protection Orders. Where an owner refused to grant a fishing permit it would mean his fishery would not be fulfilling its obligations under the PO system by permitting or improving access which, under the existing "all or nothing" rules, would mean the whole PO would have to be revoked. It was agreed there should be leave to appeal to Ministers without removing the PO as a whole. Ministers would have to amend the Protection Order to take account of the exclusion of a fishery. This could possibly be done through a variation although, currently, this would have to be done by the applicant rather than by Executive officials. There should also be flexibility to increase the size of the area covered by an Order. The question of the governance of POs, was being investigated with solicitors as current arrangements are not required by law.
Gordon Brown thanked The Bill team and the policy areas for all their hard work and also thanked the Steering Group members for their valuable input.
6. Update on Management Group
Andrew Wallace gave a short report on the work of the Forum Management Structures Sub Group.
He told the meeting that the group had met twice, and had made steady progress on fleshing out the concept of a unitary structure. However, he stressed that this was an extremely complex subject and would require a lot of work to do properly.
The group believed a Unitary Body would need to cover 5 areas of responsibility:
- Biological work - survey/research/monitoring etc. (as per Trusts)
- Enforcement (as per DSFBs)
- Fisheries development and promotion (as per Fish Scotland/ Floating Line etc)
- Management of access issues such as POs (as per Liaison Groups)
- Deal with statutory functions of the Board (as per DSFBs but with expanded remit)
Some work had been done by the group on assessing the options there might be for sizes of management areas, and what sort of core functions and costs might be associated with these. Options from compliance with WFD Sub Basin Catchments to aggregated DSFBs had been discussed.
SEERAD had agreed to fund an independent appraisal of this issue, and tenders had been sought.
AW also reported that the group had agreed that a pilot should be considered to test some of these ideas, pre-legislation, and that approaches had been made in the Solway area. He reported that a meeting had been held between the Solway Boards and the Galloway Fisheries Trust at which various views had been expressed but that there appeared to be support for looking at this idea in more detail. He reported that further meetings would be required to confirm this, but once a clear steer had been given by the principal parties to be involved, he would arrange for the Working Group, accompanied by the Executive, to meet with the key players to discuss progress.
He asked for support for this process from the Forum Steering Group, who were happy for the Sub-Group to proceed with these negotiations. It was agreed that once the Solway Boards and Trust had agreed to proceed, that other interests e.g.) coarse and game angling interests etc on the ground should become involved in discussions.
Action - Minutes of the last 2 sub group meetings to be circulated.
7. Proposed Agenda for the Freshwater Fisheries Forum on 12th December 2005
Visit from the Deputy Minister, Rhona Brankin
The Bill - Further Consultation - Alistair Prior
Gyrodactylus salaris - Presentation - Arthur Griffiths
Future of the Forum
8. A.O.B
Future of the Forum/Steering Group
The group felt that there were still a significant number of issues that could be taken forward post March 2006. After a brief discussion, the general consensus was that it would be beneficial if SEERAD kept on the role as chair because of their neutral role and also it would help them to keep them in touch with the various groups.
9. Date and Place of Next Meeting
It was agreed that the next meeting would be held on Monday 27th March 2006 at 10.00a.m. in the Municipal Buildings, Corn Exchange Road, Stirling.