CHAPTER FOUR ASPIRATIONS AND BARRIERS
4.1 This section details participants' hopes and expectations for their old age, the extent to which they were planning in different areas, and the barriers to fulfilling their aspirations. It is structured around the four areas which participants used to conceptualise old age: health, money, retirement age (i.e. freedom from work commitments), and activities and social contact after retirement (i.e. freedom from family commitments and the potential for loneliness).
Health
Aspirations for health
4.2 There was optimism - or certainly widespread hope - among the participants that they would be healthy in old age. However, deteriorating health was the aspect of ageing about which they were most worried. There was significant concern about having to rely on someone else to look after them. The following quote was typical:
That's basically one thing I'm worried about getting old. It's not money or anything like that, it's just not being able to look after myself.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
4.3 In terms of difficulties across equality strands, the only apparent difference was that women seemed to be more concerned about this than men.
4.4 As the following quotes illustrate, while general concerns about health were universal, specific or heightened concerns were due to personal circumstances such as an illness that they already had, family medical history or problems witnessed through work experience:
The past three women generations in my mum's family all died at 59, so me and my mum just keep thinking 'God, what's going to happen now?'
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
After working in the hospital, yes. Just where I worked was a dementia ward, it was people from the age of 40 onwards, and so that's what I'm worried about.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
Cultural differences
4.5 Although, like everyone else, Asian participants did not want to be "a burden", they were confident that they could depend on their families to look after them and therefore appeared to have fewer worries about what might happen to them if their health deteriorated. They felt that the Asian community respected older people more and felt sorry for the way older white people were treated by their families and communities. They explained that it would be seen as "disgraceful" in the Asian community to put your mother or father in a home, that older people are more respected and it is a religious obligation to look after elderly relatives in the same way it is to look after children. Such feelings are summed up in the following extracts:
I think different communities have different views on older people. I know in the Asian community we actually look up to our older generation and…
Exactly. We have them as long as we can, not put them in a home.
Wisdom and their experiences of life, and we don't really see them as a burden as such.
...I feel sorry for them [older white people], you know, when you see them like not respected much and the younger generation treating them badly or they're left alone in their homes and stuff, and you feel really, really hurt.
…It's like you look after your kids, but you also look after your elderly mother and father, so they're just as much your responsibility as your own children are.
(Female, C2DE, 33-57, Asian, Glasgow)
4.6 When asked if they thought that the treatment of the older generation might change in the future (as second and third generation Asians become more assimilated, for example) they felt that this may not happen because it is a religious obligation, not just a cultural norm, so "as long as our religion lives, this thing is going to be there".
4.7 A few white participants spontaneously mentioned that the Asian community treats their older people better and that the white community could learn from this example. As the following participant suggested:
…the Asian community, they look after each other. For what I know, I've friends, so I know what pretty much goes on. I like that sort of thing. I just think it's a shame that, quote unquote, it's white people who are not the same. It's actually sad really…That's what we lack maybe compared to Asian culture.
(Male, C2DE, 23-37, Dundee)
Planning for health and barriers to planning
4.8 In terms of trying to ensure good health in old age, behaviour was divided with some younger participants trying to exercise and eat healthily and others giving it little thought. There was often a specific impetus cited by those who were trying to eat healthily and exercise. These included illness, family medical history (such as seeing a family member's health deteriorate at a young age) and wanting to live longer in order to experience events happening to children or grandchildren. One participant explained:
...you'll see a granddaughter's wedding or maybe the older one. So that sort of would be nice to see it.
(Female, C2DE, 33-57, Asian, Glasgow)
4.9 Those who were not actively preparing for a healthy old age had a variety of reasons for this: some simply hadn't thought about it, others felt that you can try and be healthy but this will not guarantee health in old age as genetics and other factors mean that ill-health in old age can happen to the most health conscious people. There was also a more general feeling that it is hard to plan for anything that far in advance because people are dealing with more immediate issues. The following extracts express such sentiments:
There was a guy there [care home]. He'd been up Mount Everest four or five times, an exceptionally fit guy but by the time I started working there, he was in a wheelchair.
…And then there was other people who'd never done anything apart from just walking to the office each day in exactly the same state. So you can't tell, it's your lot.
That's right, it's the luck of the draw isn't it?
(Male, C2DE, 23-37, Dundee)
We're probably just dealing with daily problems, daily routine with our kids and this is happening and we don't think long term as far as that, about 70 years. I don't even know whether I'm going to be alive or not.
(Female, C2DE, 33-57, Asian, Glasgow)
4.10 Participants nearing retirement age were starting to think about their health a little more - but there was also a view that there was no point in changing things as the damage would already have been done. One participant explained:
Well at my age, I says well if it's going to do me some damage I've got enough damage done already so what's another wee bit damage?
(Male, 55-69, Disabled, Edinburgh)
4.11 Other than age, there were no apparent differences across the equality strands in terms of health-related planning.
4.12 Overall, the motivations and barriers relating to healthy living for a healthy old age appeared much the same as the motivations and barriers which affect people thinking about health in the short and medium term: there was awareness of what you should be doing but concerns about the cost of healthier food; how "boring life would be" if you followed all the advice; reaction against being preached at, "scare tactics" and being bombarded with too much information about healthy living; and the view that "if it tastes good, I'll eat it.
4.13 Generally, those aged over 85 said that they had not consciously tried to be healthy when they were younger but they had nonetheless expected to be healthy when they were older.
Money
4.14 Pensions are not a devolved matter and are therefore outwith the remit of the Executive's Strategy. However, financial concerns (mainly relating to pensions) emerged as a key theme in the discussions and, after poor health, lack of money was seen as the main barrier to a fulfilling old age. Although the Strategy will not be able to make specific recommendations on pensions planning or the state pension age, an understanding of the importance of this issue is essential. Furthermore, the Strategy may be able to encourage and assist people to make better financial plans for their old age.
Financial aspirations
4.15 Participants naturally wanted to have enough money to live on when they are older, in order to enjoy their retirement. They did, however, have concerns that this may not actually be the case. For example:
Well I would hope that I will be able to look after myself and have my own place and just still be financially independent. But behind that, I know I'm not going to be.
(33-57, LGBT, Edinburgh)
4.16 Some participants felt that a choice had to be made between having a decent standard of living now and saving for retirement:
It'd be nice to be able to afford to put away enough for your retirement and [still] have a decent standard of living now.
(ABC1, 33-57, Jedburgh)
4.17 Of the participants who had already retired, most had not given serious thought to their income in retirement beforehand. The follow situations were typical:
No. When you're working you never gave any thought to retiral. I never even gave much thought to my pension. I never ever thought about my pension. Of course I was in a professional office, I was a chartered surveyor, and of course we had to make our own arrangements for our pension, but I never thought anything about retiral when I was working.
(Male, 85+, Edinburgh)
No, no, I never had nothing like that (pension). I actually had a thing going at one time but as usual after a few years work was a bit tight so I cashed it in and never got another one. Anyway it ended up I didn't have nothing when I retired.
(Male, 55-69, Disabled, Edinburgh)
4.18 Some had savings rather than a pension. One participant explained:
…it's going to be a long time before I have a job where I'm going to actually look for a career and take out a pension there, so [I thought] I'll just set up a kind of savings account with the bank and a certain amount of my wages goes in each week.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
4.19 Most, however, did feel that they had enough money to live on and some were actually surprised by how much they received. Those who were receiving disability allowances in addition to their state pensions were particularly likely to say they had enough money to live on. One disabled woman commented:
The pension system is quite good. I haven't got any complaints on what I get for a pension. As a matter of fact I'm a lot better off than when my mother and father were when they were pensioners.
(Female, 55-69, Disabled, Jedburgh)
Financial planning and barriers to planning
4.20 Among those below the state pension age, behaviour differed greatly in terms of contributions to pensions. While some had no private pension, others had started saving at a young age. Some participants had been encouraged by their parents, in some cases because parents had suffered losses on their own pensions or were worried about their own retirement:
I've already started paying into some kind of saving account for this - my dad's pension was basically cut in half a couple of years ago and so I started to think well maybe I should do something about this.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
4.21 Others did not mention reasons for having a pension but most of those who did had been offered a pension through their employer.
4.22 Among those who were not contributing to a pension the main reasons - sometimes recognised as excuses - were that it is too far ahead; they were more worried about the immediate future than retirement; they would rather save money for when they have children and a family than for retirement; because the thought is too worrying; or simply that they had not thought about it. A less common reason was that it was too complicated. The quotes below exemplify some of the reasons given:
To be truthful at the moment I don't know what to think, it's too far in front of me because I don't know what's round the corner at the moment. I'm not going to worry what is going to happen to me in 10-15 years time, I'm worried what is going to happen to us next month.
(Female, 23-37, Disabled, Dundee)
No, I haven't to be honest, I haven't thought about it. It's not something that's ever worried me, to be honest. I don't really like to think about things too deeply because it does, it does scare me.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
4.23 There was a general consensus that there is a great deal of uncertainty around pensions: both in relation to whether a state pension would be available and the security of private pensions. It was unclear what effect this was having on contributions although it seemed possible that participants might save more if they were guaranteed to get it back - or at least that the uncertainty was used as a justification for not contributing.
4.24 Other than among Asian participants (discussed below), there were no apparent differences across the equality strands in relation to financial planning.
Cultural differences
4.25 In relation to planning financially for retirement, the Asian participants had some different perspectives from the other groups. There was a consensus among this group that people save money but not necessarily in the form of a pension.
4.26 They also discussed the fact that they have less reason to save for retirement (rather than saving for their children's weddings, for example) as, in their community, children financially support their parents when they get older. One woman explained:
…I've never heard my mum complaining about an unpaid bill or electricity being cut off. Not that they've got hundreds of money coming in, it's just because I know at the back of my mind that one of my brothers has dealt with it.
(Female, C2DE, 33-57, Asian, Glasgow)
Government versus individual responsibility
4.27 In terms of what younger participants thought should happen to pensions in the future, the consensus was that there should be a government pension that guarantees people a certain standard of living. There was more debate as to whether everyone should get a state pension or whether it should only go to those who need it:
The government should be guaranteeing a minimum.
…the system's maybe being over burdened by people needing help that maybe don't necessarily need that help.
(ABC1, 33-57, Jedburgh)
4.28 Beyond providing a state pension, there was support for the idea that the government should make contributions to a private pension compulsory and be responsible somehow for the security of those private pensions.
4.29 Although most of those who had already retired were relying on the state pension, there was a feeling that it was also an individual's responsibility to save. It was perceived as unfair that the government should have to pay for people who have never saved, although exceptions were made for those whose circumstances made this impossible. The following comment was typical:
Well I think if you've worked all your life and you've paid your insurance stamp and all that then fair enough they should contribute to your pension but I also think that you should save up or pay into a pension scheme so that you are helping as well.
(Female, 55-69, Disabled, Jedburgh)
4.30 Changing attitudes to personal debt and increased personal debt were seen as having a negative impact on longer-term savings. The thinking was that people are being encouraged to get into debt rather than save. Having to pay off that debt then compounds the problem as people are unable to pay off debt at the same time as contributing to a pension. One participant noted:
…bank loans, whatever, and people are in major, major debt, rather than - and it seems to be like a different kind of approach to the old way which was you had to save really hard, look after the pennies and the pounds would look after themselves.
(Female, ABC1, 23-37, Kingussie)
4.31 There was discussion about whether the government should be doing more to encourage people to save. Arguments were made that people do not listen to government advice, or that the information is already there but people choose to ignore it. Others felt that the government should put a more "positive slant" on things and not use "scare tactics".
Retirement age
4.32 There was widespread support for the retirement age being flexible and allowing people to work for as long as they wanted to and were capable. For example:
I think it's a reason to be more flexible…my dad's 67, and he's still working at his job. He's been given a yearly renewable contract which I think is good for that workplace, but I think we need to think more along these lines than just saying that's it.
(Male, C2DE, 23-37, Dundee)
4.33 There was also support for having the flexibility to work part-time before stopping work altogether.
4.34 At the same time, however, there was an equally widespread perception that retiring around 60 or 65 seemed "about right". There were no specific reasons given for this being the appropriate age and it seems likely that it is, at least in part, driven by 60 or 65 being seen as the 'normal' age to retire. Working to 68, for example, would therefore be perceived as working an extra three years. There also appeared to be an assumption that people would at least take stock at 60 or 65, and make a decision about whether they wanted to continue to work. There were no apparent differences across the equality strands.
4.35 The main reason given for having a flexible retirement age was that it depends on the individual and, in particular, their health. This ties in with the idea that 'old age' is defined more by health than by chronological age. The following quote illustrates the view of many:
It depends on the individual. I mean you'll get somebody of 65 that really needs to retire at that age on health grounds, but if they are forced to keep on because it's the law that they maybe have to go to 68, 70, they're going to be struggling those last years to keep up.
(Female, 55-69, Disabled, Jedburgh)
4.36 There was a feeling that retirement age depends on the job with some jobs, such as office work, being suitable for an older person and others, such as manual work, not suitable.
4.37 In terms of when participants wanted to stop working, there appeared to be two main perspectives. The dominant view - demonstrated in the quote below - was that you would retire as soon as you could afford to, but the other view was that it was desirable to keep working as long as you can. Again, there were no obvious differences across the equality strands:
It's not a specific age, I mean, if you can afford to retire at 60 people would do it. But if you have to wait till you're 70 then you have to wait till you're 70.
(ABC1, 33-57, Jedburgh)
4.38 There was a perception among younger respondents that the state pension age would have increased further by the time they came to retire. This was coupled with a concern that if the state pension age was increased, they might be too old to enjoy their retirement.
4.39 A number of pros and cons emerged at both the individual and societal levels in terms of people working longer. There was a feeling that forcing someone to stop working before they were ready to would make them feel "useless" and that they no longer had a purpose. For example:
If you stop older people from working at 60 or 65 or in between, then you're leaving them without a purpose, leaving them dangling with nothing to do.
(Female, C2DE, 33-57, Asian, Glasgow)
4.40 In addition, it was felt that society could benefit from older people working longer, even if it is 'only' volunteering and from older people passing on their experience to younger people. One participant suggested:
I think it would be better for society to work that wee bitty longer. Even like as I said, even if they weren't getting paid, if they did a couple of hours of volunteering.
(Female, 23-37, Disabled, Dundee)
4.41 However, related to the youth-centred orientation discussed earlier, there was a feeling that it was good to allow people to work as long as they wanted but not if this meant depriving a younger person of a job:
You think if they'd cut the pension age maybe down the way it would make more jobs for the younger people. That's one way of looking at it.
(Female, 55-69, Disabled, Jedburgh)
4.42 Of course, this concern may well be a hangover from previous eras of high unemployment and less relevant in the context of an ageing population.
4.43 Stereotypical views of older workers were also apparent in discussions: they were seen as more experienced but also slower, less willing to change and less comfortable with new technologies. For example:
Sometimes you're better getting rid of the old ones because if they're that set in their ways, if you want change, they're an absolute nightmare. We've tried this before, it's the same, it never works.
(ABC1, 33-57, Jedburgh)
4.44 The difficulties older workers face in finding new jobs (if, for example they wanted to change jobs or find a different part-time job rather than reducing their hours in their current job) were recognised.
Activities and social contact in retirement
4.45 Those who had already retired tended to spend their time on a range of hobbies which included keep fit, gardening, stamp collecting and playing bridge. Some were involved in community groups and clubs. A couple of the female participants aged 85+ appeared to have particularly active lives, with involvement in a wide range of activities. One of these women explained:
Well I have a lot of hobbies and I follow them up and they weren't all expensive or anything…I belong to a bridge club and I sew and I knit and I go out, I go to Guilds and things. None of my things were expensive but they filled in the time you know. And I volunteered for the lunch club, to help in the lunch club now I'm retired.
(Female, 85+, Jedburgh)
4.46 However, one participant felt he had too much time on his hands:
There's me now, I've too much time on my hands, I don't know what to do with myself. I sit in the house on my own… I sit and watch the daft TV.
(ABC1, 55-69, Dundee)
4.47 When younger participants were asked what they wanted to spend their time doing when they retired, the most common answers were spending time with grandchildren and going on holiday (the latter, in particular, contrasts with what our retired participants actually did). Reflecting the conceptualisation of old age as a time free from commitments, one woman mentioned specifically that she was looking forward to going on holiday without children:
Go away and enjoy yourself. Go on holidays, not have to worry about money and work.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
4.48 Although on the one hand, female participants (in particular) looked forward to freedom from family responsibilities, they saw spending time with their family as one of the main things they would do when they were older. In some ways, it was apparent that family becomes increasingly important, in terms of social contact as well as practical support and care. One participant commented:
Yeah, it does come back to the family, the family unit, because I think as you get older, it's probably harder to make good friends.
(ABC1, 33-57, Jedburgh)
4.49 Another participant had thought about losing the ability to drive and how that would affect access to her family. Again, the Asian participants were more confident that their families will step in and they "will not be left alone".
4.50 Some mentioned having time for hobbies while others were worried that they did not currently have hobbies so they would need to find something to keep them occupied when they retired. Although the benefits of developing hobbies and interests before old age were mentioned, there was no evidence that anyone was actually doing this. Having a more active role in the community was also mentioned.
4.51 As noted above, the LGBT participants discussed the perceived youth-centredness of the gay 'scene'. There was some disagreement about this with one view being that there was a range of clubs and activities for older gay people although these could perhaps be better publicised:
Because there's not a thing for the older gay man.
Or the older gay women. There's nothing. It's all catered for the youngsters now.
…there's clubs for various things…so it's something that I think we need to be more aware of.
…They don't revolve round alcohol and getting off with someone at the end of the night.
(33-57, LGBT, Edinburgh)
4.52 The last point in the quote above, about the gay 'scene' not necessarily revolving around alcohol and "getting off with someone" raised the difficulties faced by older gay people when they did want to have a drink and socialise. One view was that "a lot of older gay people are quite happy going out drinking" but another view was that, in gay clubs and bars, older men were seen as "queens" and were not really welcome.
4.53 More generally, younger participants thought there were plenty of activities for older people which might help "get them out and about" meeting people. They cited various local examples including Over 50s clubs, walking clubs, classical music mornings, day centres, and organised day trips. These younger participants perceived potential barriers to taking advantage of these opportunities including lack of publicity about what is available and accessibility: "you shouldn't need to rely on a car". However, the attitude and willingness of some older people to take part was seen as the biggest barrier. While some might go with a little more "active encouragement", it was felt that others would never go (there was no discussion as to why this might be the case and little apparent sympathy):
There's so many folk say that. I'm not sitting down with all those old folk, but granny's even said it to me. You know, I'm not going with all those old folk and it's folk that she worked with!
But it's just weird. Some folk are just really reluctant to go and join in.
…if she [participant's grandmother] does go out of the house, she walks down the street with her head down looking at the ground and it's just the way she's been. And you get folk like that who just won't socialise, because they're not used to it, and they will spend the rest of their days lonely.
(C2DE, 18-24, Kingussie)
Summary of key points
- Health There was optimism among the participants that they would be healthy in old age. However, health is the aspect of ageing about which they were most worried, with particular concerns about "being a burden" and having to rely on someone else to look after them.
- Money Although people naturally wanted to have enough money to live on when they are older, they had concerns that this may not actually be the case. Among those below the state pension age, behaviour differed greatly in terms of contributions to pensions with some having started saving from a young age and others not saving at all. Reasons for not contributing to pensions ranged from the fact that it is too far ahead to think about, to it being too worrying.
- Retirement age There was widespread support for the retirement age being flexible and allowing people to work for as long as they wanted to and were capable. At the same time, however, there was an equally widespread perception that retiring around 60 or 65 seemed "about right".
- Activities and social contact in retirement Those who had already retired tended to spend their time on a range of hobbies and some were involved in community groups and clubs. However, one male participant felt he had too much time on his hands. When younger participants were asked what they wanted to spend their time doing when they retired, the most common answers were spending time with grandchildren and going on holiday (the latter, in particular, contrasts with what the retired participants actually did).